Tor servers confiscated in Germany

---

Comments

Display comments as (Linear | Threaded)

11 09 2006

#1 Shava Nerad (Reply)

Last week, a few Tor exit-node servers were seized by the German police in a

massive sting against child pornography. From our friends on the ground in

Germany, we hear that dozens and dozens of machines may have been seized.

So far as we know only six of those were Tor servers. We have heard from the

server operators. None of them has been charged.

This is not a "crackdown" on Tor, as has been widely reported. We

expect and hope that the volunteer Tor server operators in Germany will get

their equipment back after this has blown over, and there will be no action

against Tor.

Please contact me for more information.

Shava Nerad
executive director
The Tor Project
shava at freehaven dot net

11 09 2006

#1.1 citizen428 (Reply)

Shava, thanks for the comment! I’m of course aware that the recent confiscations aren’t directed against Tor per se, but I still find this whole incident a little unsettling, since I agree with the opinion stated in one of the German links, that this whole incident may be only the first step in giving Tor and similar technologies a bad name in the public opinion.

11 09 2006

#2 Shava Nerad (Reply)

absolutely! In fact, this is why I have been spending all day in Technorati commenting on blogs. Thanks for your concern, really! But the best way to keep us from getting painted with the porn folks that got busted is to make sure this doesn’t crawl up Digg, Technorati, and Google News without clarification.

So I’m a very very busy grrl today!

Thanks again!
Shava

12 09 2006

#3 Ashley S. (Reply)

I liked TOR a lot, after it became more easier to use for nerds like me.
However, this confiscation of TOR-Servers does not make me feel comfortable
if I entrust TOR with my personal informations

Another good choice to enhance ones privacy is Anonymouse (http://Anonymouse.org/).
I know this is a little bit like comparing apples and oranges, because Anonymouse
is a web-proxy. However, it is still a good alternative. In oppsite to TOR it is
even more easier to use, it is faster and does not need anything to setup.

Bye,
Ash

12 09 2006

#4 Shava Nerad (Reply)

None of the servers we administer keeps logs, and no server I know of does. We don’t recommend it, but of course I can’t guarantee no one does.

We would never recommend it.

So, your information should be safe.

I’m sure the Anonymous folks are fine folks, and Anonymous.org says they will not give out your information "on the legal use of [their] server." However, they do not say if they will give out your information for suspicion of illegal activity, with or without a subpoena, or if they wait for you to be convicted.

If you are convicted, the legal authorities probably don’t need their records, you see. So that means that the authorities would likely come to their door with or without a subpoena, asking for your records because you are a suspect in illegal activity.

Ask them what they would do then. With the subpoena. And without it.

Do this for any service provider you deal with. I used to run a 6000 user ISP, where we hosted Earth First! Journal and a number of other sites that attracted attention.

Every three months, the FBI or someone would come to our front desk, and someone would fetch me. And I’d ask if there were imminent danger to persons, and he’d say no, so I’d ask for a subpoena.

You know what the officer/investigators said just about every time I did this?

"Gosh, no one else asks for a subpoena."

And then they went away, and never came back with a subpoena for the same request.

So in my tenure there, we never gave out legal records except for when it was once substantiated to my satisfaction that a person’s safety was immediately involved.

Ask your providers, see if they would do the same.

Yrs,
Shava

19 09 2006

#5 Markus (Reply)

The Independent Centre for Privacy Protection, who’s ANON mix server has also been confiscated, has now published a formal complaint against the confiscation court order. German language:
http://www.datenschutzzentrum.de/projekte/anon/20060915-beschwerde-anon.pdf

13 05 2007

#6 Martin (Reply)

Shava, you obviously do not know European or especially German laws.

It is correct that with a subpoena you do not have the choice to say "No". However, Europan and German laws do not allow to record the IP-address and other data unless required for the technical process or for billing. Both things do not apply to Anonymouse, so they would violate laws if they would record anything – which of course they do not do as you can see on their privacy policy. So it does not matter if there is a subpoena or not, because they can not reveal anything they do not have.

Add Comment